So I realize I didn't give the reasoning for this possible change. But here were some of the collective thoughts that were being bounced around on voice the other night.

Having Both Dash and Inherent movement speed bonuses makes it too easy to just run and scout, even if the other team has an AT its near impossible to punish the bad positioning.

Removing Speed and keeping dash; Allows the playmaking ability to close the gap, and even scout still with possibly getting away, but also makes it so that the players needs to be more aware of when they should or shouldnt use their dash.

Removing dash and keeping speed; Im a fan of the former so this will probably come off as biased. But to me I dont think any class should have more base movement speed then another, it's why I hated back when LMG would get a boost for back peddling. To me this boost in speed doesn't promote any out play just out run.

Where is the ‘Remove AT’ option :)

lol xd

I think AT is a good example of it being bad for so long that we slowly added things to it, now we need to start removing stuff.

Even with 80hp vs 100hp of Marines the armor outweighs the 20hp.

The dash is crazy... It gets you vision, saves your life, lets you retreat, lets you push. It's way to strong atm, especially if the person playing it is leading or a vocal player.

Didn't even know AT had a movement speed increase, should prob just leave that and remove the dash IMO.

The dash is what makes the class OP but also viable, without the dash it would be kind of useless even with the armor. Right now it fills every role and even with poor decision making (Dave) the class is extremely hard to kill with multiple get out of jail free cards. Personally I wouldn't play AT over Marine or LMG if the dash was outright removed.

agreed I think the dash is what makes it viable as well. So removing the inherent movement speed still allows it to maintain its identity.

There are other options outside of dash and speed that can be looked at for adjustment.

How much of a movement speed increase does AT get currently?

I’d rather keep it simple at the moment. The dash gives the outplay potential as wel as closing ability so its bullets can hit people falling. Again going back to the identity thing. As for how much Imovement speed I’m not sure but it’s definitely faster than marine at base speed.

what is the armor difference vs marine

Marine has no armor

AT has 1 ignore on kinetic and explosive, 30% kinetic mit, 50% explosive mit.

Instead of changing mobility on the class made for mobility, my thought was to explore armor values first.

+1 King. Does AT need armor? Would AT with marine hp work? Or add additional hp?

yeah moving down explosive armor to like 25 and kinect to 15 would probably be a great place to start

AT is the only class that can just walk through a nade or direct law, but then can dash at you and blow you up with OP weapons.

I don't mind the dash/mobility/op weapons but with that much armor a marine pretty much always loses 1v1

Had armor in there just so they couldnt be OHKO'ed by naders and LAWs, but also gave them some kinetic so they do have a chance to get in and get out without being at 5hp. Nader SG was moved to Bypass when we first made the changes so they were the only class to 2-shot an AT, but that change got reverted by mistake preseason.

Nerf Auto pistols back to the range there suppose to be and Im fine with keeping dash.

My suggestions -

Remove any inherit speed bonus on the class.

Remove armor but give it 100 HP.

Additional suggestions for QoL

Let me rework dash to use energy and give it an energy cell similar to medic. This would help us balance the dash and make it much more predictable for users rather than the painful to time reload it has now.

The grenadier shotgun is trash and should be reverted anyways - I believe there is a minimum range on the red shotgun. I have other ways to balance Nader I’ll suggest/ put up for test soon.

those all sound like awful ideas

dash on a cool down is fine,

reduce range on DUAL AUTO a bit

Have sniper/ripper/naders 40s do bypass to counter it

reduce armor by half

And thats why Oct was never asked to assist in reworks

so long as the bypass doesnt affect how much damage other classes take from it that would work. or if the easiest solution is to remove armor entirely so that the bypass buffs on the other classes doesnt increase dmg to say meds / marines then go with that.

Wont affect anything but armor users