Free format with no roster limit is catering to inactives. Either play the game and be worth your salary or don't. There is no reason to have a bunch of people on rosters who have little intention of playing the game. Who is really being excluded? Everyone has the same chance to make a squad or get active and get recruited.
The salary makes for tough decisions on rosters, but so did roster limits. Suggesting no roster limit at this point would give us a 4 squad season.

If you want to make this game more exciting just add/edit classes.

During playoffs do 3 15mins games. Makes it more interesting

Roster Limit =/= Salary Cap
Nobody said don't have a roster limit as pertains to players on a squad. You still put a cap on amount of players that can join a squad - that has always been a thing.

Also you may have every Sunday to jump on Infantry but that's not the case w/ everyone else's schedule. That's a pretty narrowed minded viewpoint. Fuck you because you can't show up every Sunday evening?

Yo Ernie, sorry - because you can only make 3 / 6 games, you don't deserve to be on a roster.

I thought you were suggesting that, no roster limit. My mistake.

I didn't have every sunday to jump on infantry, I actually missed half of the past 2 seasons. You are getting personal here. Sorry I share a different opinion Staley.
There were squads with room for Ernie. There were squads who could have kicked other inactives to make room for Ernie. They didn't see it as worth it cause they didn't know if he would even show to one weekend. Sorry man.

I think we've always used somewhere between 12-14 for roster limit, it'd be silly if there was 25 players on one squad.

Not getting personal - I just used Ernie as an example because he's the first player that came to mind due to my open steam convos. x.x The same could be said for someone like Trisance (I don't know his schedule but he's been hit or miss in seasons he's played) or myself (I'd have probably missed 4/5 games this past season). It doesn't matter who the player is; the player shouldn't be restricted from joining a squad because he might not be able to show up every weekend which is what your previous argument was suggesting and what salary cap promotes.

A fairly adult thread. The first of it's kind on FI??

Staley can you come back as admin please? Salary cap system has been losing the player base for seasons now and these retards dont see it. Why bother having a poll voting for it when last time FFA won and admins still used salary. Make infantry great again!

They would still be restricted if a squad was full based on roster limit. (# of players). They would have to find another squad unless a squad was willing to accommodate them by kicking someone. Same shit except the better they are the harder it is to accommodate in salary. They still have other squads they can join though. If not, the salary will be increased.
Without salary cap there probably would have been 4-5 squads last season and would be next season

Let's bring back drift to run USL (even though it was only SL in the past) - he's a man of the people.

There is nothing to stand on for the argument claiming that there'd be less squads w/ or w/o salary cap. It'd be 6 squads either way, and if anything, it leans more in the favor of additional squads w/o salary cap. I've seen maybe one complaint asking for additional roster spots on an FFA 12-14 roster, whereas salary cap just blatantly says fuck off without consideration.

I've still not seen anything to argue the double class players either;
Fax is 205 (somewhere around there)
He's a 205 medic no question. He's probably a 100+ marine too, but not a 205 marine (that's top 5 status, not a knock against Fax).
Salary cap is saying he's not allowed to play marine without being a detriment to his squad.
Same situation for me. I like playing marine (-5) but if I'm not playing medic for my cost (50 or w/e I am) then it's a hit against me for playing two classes and we're not going to give everyone two ratings. That's silly.

We could also argue that the reason everybody is so opposed to draft is "You should be able to play with who you want" and yet salary cap is likewise restricting that for some players. Which way do you want it? Play with who you want or no??? If I recall correctly, sov/champ were on squads together almost every season prior to salary cap and now it's literally impossible for that to happen. Are they never to be allowed to play together again? What if you were told you weren't allowed to play with the player/s you most prefer to play with (ie: draft league)? Again, I understand the hate for draft league but if we're being realistic, it IS the most balanced option. The hate stems from restricting who plays with who though and yet salary does the same shit for some people so you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Dis like forum mafia.

<b>FOS: r, j, doctor.nickk</b>

Ah, true tg.


Staley where were you 2 seasons ago when I didn't want salary cap, asshole?
And where is Armor to argue it?


I think salary is the best option at this point, despite the drawbacks. If polled again, I would still vote for salary and I think most people would again also.

Each system has its flaws. Just need to make the best with what we have unless someone has some radical idea that could change everything.

1. Come up with more accurate ratings for salary costs

2. Find the best squad salary cap for the league based on those costs

3. Determine the correct roster caps/minimums.

With the salary system right now there is no hard cap on roster because if you have salary space your squad more than likely needs the help. But what if we added a hard cap just to make it so a squad like Raw Dogs can still be made but some of those players need to be spread out across other squads?

Introduce some restrictions where you can only have X amount of people from top tier of salary costs and require you to have X amount of people from the mid/bottom tier. I could just add another table to the database next to the player's salary cost called "tier" and it updates based on their cost. Salary system could check to see if the squad meets those requirements or something.

I don't remember where I was 2 seasons ago x.x - you guys arguing w/ a someone who got dementia - x.x; I was probably watching hentai w/ kaga.

"If polled again, I would still vote for salary and I think most people would again also."
VALID POINT - poll to the right agrees w/ you. rekt quicker than negzero; although curious the results if we removed Don't Care and the Draft.

--

Still don't believe that continuing to add further complexity on top of an overly complex rating system will make improvements but I'm all for being proven wrong.

Why are we using big numbers anyway, was it too hard to use 1-10 (or 1-100) to rate players.
Big numbers are scary.

Ask dave about the number thing. I was fine with using small numbers.

"Introduce some restrictions where you can only have X amount of people from top tier of salary costs and require you to have X amount of people from the mid/bottom tier"

I like this idea and I know mecca had proposed it at the start of the whole salary system. Its worth a look.

What if nobody from the bottom tier wants to join you or they leave mid season and you don't meet the requirement @_@

lets definitely add more rules and restrictions on this game, it's what we need. Let's tell everyone how they can form their team with a playerbase less than 80. Who cares about the people that only want to play 3/6 matches, we need more squad rules and regulations to make sure everything is balanced.

Glad you see my point!!!

That's why you be nice to the newbs

More hoops for Apollo!

I do enjoy seeing these perspectives. I do have a question for those against Salary and pro FFA/Draft

What will either FFA or Draft do to increase current level of competition and activity?

While there are some questions for current Salary Standard:

Utility players like Fairfax that can successfully play two classes and how his rating is calculated?

Players like Trisance and devil that play once in a while and are high rated (not taken into account activity) how do they benefit from this or how do the squads that want them benefit from this?

I feel like these scenarios are the Anomalies. At the end of the day each format we choose (poll based) will have their respective anomalies; it is up to staff to minimize these as much as possible. I'd like to hear thoughts.

"Can't believe someone is calling PG, a core that has won S3/4/5 and made finals in 6, not failing when they lost to chica playing marine in OT with no sol LOL."

Sov, which OT match are you referring to with chica as marine and no sol?

Also, wasn't the point of salary to break up the dominate active cores and shake up the team landscape without completely forcing people into squads they don't like? I'm not sure who all was on "PG" squads in season 3-6, but do you think salary impacted the groups ability to stay together? Who got kicked from PG to make room for you and Yosh when you guys rejoined?